I have yet again wrapped up another day using KDE as my main desktop environment. Everyone has had some appealing arguments (and a few were heated enough to the point of deletion). I have to say that both camps really do have quite a lot to offer. I have come to appreciate some of the KDE apps very much–klipper is very convenient so far. Yakuake is something I would have never found without your suggestions. Konquerer has far more than I ever expected! I do think, on the application level, that many of the KDE packages have more features and seem to be more mature than the gnome applications. The system integration seems a little better worked through as well.
Currently my mood is that of going back to gnome however. I will stay with it until my week is through, as promised. I feel like, despite the many features of these applications, there is not anything that I’m missing within gnome. I suppose we could argue that I have not used KDE long enough to learn some of the tools to the point of missing them, but those tools that I have used seem equal to what I find that I prefer in gnome. Perhaps I do need to stick with KDE a while longer to make it a fair comparison.
I’m not going to do anything drastic yet. I’m still going to keep using it through sunday at least. Perhaps we’ll find something more yet. I will say that the KDE crowd seems more vocal and proud than the gnome crowd (based on comments). I wonder why that is…
Ok, do you do any web development? This is why I use KDE.
http://buranen.info/?p=75
Kate can save to ftp by just opening it in konq, then file -> save as.
Furthermore, I keep .rdp files to connect to client servers on an sftp:// server that I can open in konq and then open with “tsclient” from there. You can’t do this in nautilus.
Basically my argument is that gnome sucks with remote files.
When you go back to using gnome, you may want to check out Glipper. Which is a gnome app that takes the place of Klipper. I dunno if it entirely measures up since its been a long while since I’ve used KDE, but it is certainly better than no clipboard management at all which is what Gnome defaults to. I’ve been planning on doing my own “week with KDE” experiment” for some time as well. After all I started on KDE, and I doubt I’d have stuck with linux so long if KDE hadn’t been there to help me make the transition from windows. But I’m a gnome lover now, and won’t give KDE its 2nd chance until KDE 4 comes out, and I have some really new stuff to see.
I hope you end up using the desktop you actually like the best. I hope you arent’t frrlong some pressure to do something you don’t want to do 🙂
I as a KDE guy, always spend some time in Gnome just just to keep up (and to have better knowledge to assist those not using KDE)
As for the vocalness, or pride, of KDE users I think that it may be due to KDE being the ‘little guy’ in the Ubuntu world so to speak.
I’m curious, why would you go back to Gnome? What things do you miss in KDE?
Too bad you didn’t mention any troubles today. I can’t think of anything in particular, since it’s been a while since I’ve used gnome.
I’ve been following your week with KDE but not reading the discussions, so I’m not sure if these apps have been pointed out to you yet, but they’re definitely worth checking out:
Keep — nifty little GUI for rdiff-backup.
Kommander — GUI creator that can interface with DCOP and shell commands. Really fast way to create your own graphical tools once you get the hang of it. For example, I made a GUI for a CLI x10 control program, which comes in handy a lot. Also made an interface to fortune for fun. 🙂
Krusader — an excellent twin-pane file manager. I’m not sure how alternatives like Gnome Commander are, but this thing is very nice and highly configurable.
Reasons for using Gnome :
a. Politically correct (GTK is “open”)
b. Career correct (since all big names defaults to it; Debian, Ubuntu, SLED, Red Hat …)
c. Brain correct (design for ease of use. no thinking needed, we will think for you)
There will be no apps that is in KDE that cannot be found in Gnome .. eventually.
Klipper is good, get glipper.
Knopppix is good, get gnoppix.
KDE is good, get gde ..oops
Reasons for not using KDE :
a. Politically incorrect (some still have the perception that it is built on proprietary Qt …. sigh)
b. Career incorrect (only fun loving distro is defaulted to KDE)
c. Brain incorrect (you have [the freedom] to [easily] learn how to configure it to your taste or needs 🙂
But really, just use what makes you feel comfortable/happy and fill your needs.
This is the greatness of open source, where you have the FREEDOM to choose.
Enjoy your experiment 🙂
PS.. in case you’re wondering, I prefer the freedom to tinker (for non-techies like me) that comes with KDE 🙂
@Caesium
a. GTK is LGPL, Qt is GPL, if you or others do not know (they’ve changed it few years back). KDE library is LGPL, KDE apps are mixed of GPL and LGPL.
b. Debian supports both KDE & GNOME equally. Many companies are interested with GTK because they can use it freely (no need to pay for the library) even for closed source product. However, still many big companies choose Qt, because it will shorten development time (Google Earth uses Qt). Also if you are n00b in programming GUI, I’m sure that programming in Qt is easier than programming in GTK+.
c. Some people like “thinking”, and some others just like to use whatever they have.
I agree with the rest of your comment, just enjoy whatever you like 😉
That’s really cool, Christer. I’m glad you stuck it out. I couldn’t do it.
I’d suggest you try XFCE sometime as well. It’s a fun little lightweight manager.
I’d say that GNOME folks aren’t being as vocal because you’re already a GNOME user! The KDE folks only have a week to convince you, so they’re working hard to do so. If a KDE user decided to try GNOME for a week, you can bet the GNOME community would be quite vocal. 😉
I tried both Gnome and KDE and my choice is KDE.
I just like how it looks more modern. Yes some of the configurations are not intuitive and are located in weired placed. But I really enjoy the ability to configure programs the way I like.
In terms of “vocal and proud”, we GNOME folks just tend to be less concerned about things like this. We rarely get excited about polls on technical user websites, either. Things like that.
I guess you could say that we fight for the million, not for the one. Which is not to say that individual users are less important to us — far from it! — but I’m sure you can see this ‘broadness’ to our approach among many properties of GNOME.
“Also if you are n00b in programming GUI, I’m sure that programming in Qt is easier than programming in GTK+.”
Perhaps, but I think pygtk will beat C++/Qt for “newbs”
@john: There’s PyQt, too. 🙂
ive been a gnomer since about 2000, after the linus debarkle i decided to check out kde – and never went back – every week i end up finding i can do something else – there is soo many ways to do things and things to do, which is both kde’s strength and weakness – the lack of which is a design choice of havocs for gnome.
For my girlfriend and granma – i’ve set up with gnome (nothing to know and nothing to tweak), and it works a treat for them. but for me as a web developer – i think kde remains by far the __most__ productive environment ive come across.
at end of day its really konqueror and yakuake that makes it worth while for me though – hit F8 when browsing filesystem in konqueror and get a split window with a shell, that stays synced to the file system – v neat.
when(if) you go back to gnome – apt-get install tilda, to give you a yakuake style thing, but its much clunkier and not as smooth or nice.
if only kde integrated nicely with e17, id be in heaven.
(btw just discovered baskets in kontact – love it)
my two objections to kde are – 1) kmail has twice trashed my imap stores (so i no longer use disconnected (cached) imap – bumma) and 2) That screen configuration thing in kcontrol is just a little worse than useless.
ve been a gnomer since about 2000, after the linus debarkle i decided to check out kde – and never went back – every week i end up finding i can do something else – there is soo many ways to do things and things to do, which is both kde’s strength and weakness – the lack of which is a design choice of havocs for gnome.
For my girlfriend and granma – i’ve set up with gnome (nothing to know and nothing to tweak), and it works a treat for them. but for me as a web developer – i think kde remains by far the __most__ productive environment ive come across.
at end of day its really konqueror and yakuake that makes it worth while for me though – hit F8 when browsing filesystem in konqueror and get a split window with a shell, that stays synced to the file system – v neat.
when(if) you go back to gnome – apt-get install tilda, to give you a yakuake style thing, but its much clunkier and not as smooth or nice.
if only kde integrated nicely with e17, id be in heaven.
(btw just discovered baskets in kontact – love it)
my two objections to kde are – 1) kmail has twice trashed my imap stores (so i no longer use disconnected (cached) imap – bumma) and 2) That screen configuration thing in kcontrol is just a little worse than useless.
@Alex Lowe:
@John:
When I made my final switch to linux a couple of years ago, it was the pygtk/pyqt issue that influenced my decision in favour of GNOME.
I fell in love with GNOME because of the toolkit. I still feel empowered for being able to read and understand the source of everything on my desktop, and I love writing plugins to plug holes in my workflow.
So although I do get along in KDE, it could never bring me the same feeling of control I have with GNOME.
this seems kind of offtopic :).
You should try dolphin. It’s a file manager that will be included in kdebase for the 4.0. It’s a very shiny gnome-like app. Not a replacement of Konqueror but maybe more handy…
Try it!!
Hi!
I used to work with KDE for ages, but when switching from debian to ubuntu i got kinda hooked up by gnome – it’s soooooo beautiful! And it got all i thought i needed.
As i started to write my own website just recently (the one linked here, still work-in-progress) i remembered why i loved KDE so much; transparent access to all different kinds of data like my FTP server for example! No local editing and uploading, it all happens right there, fast and simple.
I kinda hope that KDE4 will be as sexy as gnome, so i can have both: beauty and power…
@Frederic Back:
“So although I do get along in KDE, it could never bring me the same feeling of control I have with GNOME.”
For me, it’s just the opposite. I feel in control with KDE, and limited in GNOME.
I originally used GNOME on my desktop (and, in fact, used it for several years). A year before I moved to KDE, I switched to Ubuntu. I decided to try Kubuntu Breezy, and I’ve prefered KDE ever since.
“When I made my final switch to linux a couple of years ago, it was the pygtk/pyqt issue that influenced my decision in favour of GNOME.”
I used pygtk when I was on GNOME, but I find pyqt makes more sense to me.
I guess the morale is that choice of Desktop Environment really needs to be done on a person-by-person basis.
P.S. I really qould recommend trying XFCE. I use it on all my older machines (it’s great down to a 300MHz Pentium 2, at which point Enlightement becomes better).
have you tried amarok yet?
try amarok B4 leaving KDE!!!
I also agree that GNOME is much better. It is far much more nice-looking and not as buggy as KDE.
You have a nice replacement for amarok in KDE: Exaile. If you don’t like it, you can also try Listen.
Personally, Epiphany is the biggest thing keeping me on Gnome. Since 2.12 or 2.14, I’ve found that its weaknesses are far outweighed by it’s strengths – the most important one for me being it’s amazing bookmark handling. I REALLY like being about to just start typing in the location bar and have matching bookmarks pop up.
I thought I’d heard that Konqueror was getting something similar – if it does, then that would be a major draw toward KDE. That and Vim/Emacs getting Qt/KDE skins….
It should be noted that Amarok can be run under Gnome too, although it’s much slower to start up and a bit less responsive.
I used to use Gnome but I recently switched to KDE for a few reasons. I was frustrated with Gnome’s hypersimplistic UI, but also because I really think KDE4 is going to be fantastic and I’m eagerly awaiting its release.
As far as the KDE crowd being more vocal, I think that’s probably because most people who use KDE are enthusiasts, while many Gnomers tend to be more practical, although that IS NOT to say that KDE is impractical.
I have been using KDE for years. I try Gnome every s often because it looks elegant, but I keep coming back to KDE because:
1) Network transparency: a mentioned above, being able to ssh to a site in Konq, open a text file in Kate and save it back without manually copying to and fro is very convenient.
2) I mostly use KDE apps. My most heavilly used apps, in order, are: Firefox, Konq, Kate, Kile, Kmail and Amarok.
3) Useful applets and UI enhancements: Kompose, Katapult , Klipper, and Quick File Browser
4) A lot of little things. For example the clock can be configured to show multiple time zones on mouse over, Kmoon shows the number of days to/from changes in moon phase (it is important to remember full moon days where I live)
One thing that would be useful is a lightweight browser with KDE integration based on Gecko, like Epiphany on Gnome. Opera might fill this gap, although I would prefer a free solution.
I do intend to give XFCE a try. I like it, but I have had some issues with it. I also need to find lightweight apps to go with it.
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